Here is one from the archives. It is a short but interesting discussion concerning the Death of God and who may have killed him/her.
I read a book called the History of God by Karen Armstrong a few years back. I thought it was good. She wrote about the concept of the Jewish/Christian/Muslim God and where this God came from and how this God has changed over a few thousand years.
Her recent writings however, I’m not so sure about.
Our Species has more or less killed the concept of God with the Sword of Science.
But try telling that to the millions of Fundamental Christians living in Amerika.
She takes a series of statements about god that she says need rethinking, but her thinking is a complete mess.
Interesting concept. If God is dead, then a whole lot of nay-sayers will have to admit that He at one time was very much alive, right? Also, who in the world killed Him then, and can we bring them to trial? After all murder is murder, and if He is dead, then that would explain why there is such a huge void in humanity, after all it is believed that He resides in those who believe…
Quite frankly, nonbelievers need to just give it a rest, and apologetics need to give up trying to convince humanity one way or another, especially nonbelievers. God lives in those who believe, and those who don’t well, they don’t, maybe he doesn’t. I am not sure why those who don’t believe care so much about the concept of a supreme being. Why are non believers so obsessed? Obviously the concept of a supreme being has always and more than likely will be around for as long as we are living and breathing, right? Also, as far as I can see, read, no matter whether you are a fundamentalist, or an atheist activist, neither has any real substance to stand on, so therefore it Armstrong and Dawkins and the likes of them are no different then me right now, we all want to have our day in court. Man makes meaing, whether it is language, mathematics, science, it is all man made, minus believing or attached meaning does anything really exist?
Math is man made?
Well put there.God is what you make him/her/it to be.God is different to everyone of us and so is the relationship you have with God,if you even have one….
“Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones.” Marcus Auerlius
If this author believes someone will belive her thoughts and ideas ? then, there must be a god , can we drop this ? None can prove whether god exists or not, doesn’t mean that having the conpect of God is not alive !
the name and symbols given to explain mathematical equations is as man made as the language that you speak, the code that is used in computing, that is unless you want to claim it divinely inspired. Niwa, amen…I am perplexed as to why there is a blasphemy movement by the atheists…how can you denounce that which does not exist, nor is believed for one, secondly, if the believer believes then believe, and through your good works those around you will want to know what secrets you hold towards a joy-filled life.
The language we use to represent math is man made, of course. We also use it to represent ocean currents and the orbits of planets. Are THOSE man made? There is a distinction between the LANGUAGE and the reality it is used to represent.
As for your wishy washy notion that god lives in the hearts of believers, what utter tripe.
What would you think of a friend who announced that he was so happy because he was destined to marry Angelina Jolie? The usefulness of this belief, or the idea that it makes him happy, is irrelevant against the falsity of the claim, yet this is the kind of argument defenders of religion always make.
There is no evidence for any god claims. To assert that such claims are true because people believe them is blithering foolishness. I suppose you’re prepared to grant that unicorns and leprechauns exist for those who believe in them.
He keeps me jammin-(Good Cousin)….. God isnt a being, but a force that you feel amoungst you… If you can go with that, then you are doing good..
Is he dead? That is up to everyone to believe in thier own minds…. I believe in an inner self that believes what is GOD… When I pray, I talk to my inner mind, and hope that it might go further…( Was there really a JESUS???) I think there was,,, but was there a guy who could make blind people see? Hell NO!! Jesus was a man, who people loved to follow. His belief made people feel good…He made alot of people feel like they meant something, and that all that mattered….Was he really hung on a cross (maybe—in my eyes NO)? Was he taken from his grave on Easter? ( No. he was never there to start.) From the Start, was there a Jesus~~~ Prob., and if there was , he died a happy man. Thinkin about someone in his inner self that was none other than__(GOD)(your 1st topic).. Love yah cousin (BP)…
Is God dead???? I think not… As long as your mind is still functioning,,,,,God is very alive…
Redefining the term into some personal force within (or, as Spinoza said, the great natural order of everything), simply ignores the issue.
Belief in an interventionist, omnipotent, omniscient “god” (the foundation of the big three monos) is the question. The actions and demands of the faithful not insignificant consequences thereof. And still, your personal perception notwithstanding, there’s no more evidence for the truth of your claims than for theirs.
You are certainly free to believe as you wish. Sadly, the faithful seem determined to assert (despite the total lack of evidence) that they’re right, and to inflict their ideas on the rest of us via public policy (which is intolerable).
You would appear to make little distinction between prayer and meditation, and I have nothing against the inner-self or the transcendent. But when one starts to invoke the father, son and holy spirit, condemn others to hell, hold forth on morality based on the scribblings of Bronze Age sheep herders, deny civil rights to large segments of the population, attempt to restrict access to legal medical procedures (not to mention a laundry list of egregious criminal behaviour), based on a Jesus myth for which there is no evidence outside of the book they present as both premise and conclusion, we are then dealing with an animal very different than “praying to one’s inner mind”.
If God was dead, then that wouldn’t be God. The word may be truth or fiction, but there is a standard to which anything one might call God would have to apply. God with a capital G is omnipotent, so it doesn’t die. But what if it killed itself? Can an omnipotent creature end itself? If it can’t then it isn’t omnipotent. But if it does, then it is finite and limited.
Language is limited in its ability to speak of anything singular. The multiplicity of meanings within an entire language are what give words their specific meanings.
So using language to speak or ponder an entity claimed to be One and with no other is fruitless. It is outside language’s scope. Just as well use a hammer to twist in a screw.
The Tao Te Ching says on page one….the Tao that can be spoken is not the Tao. I tend to agree. Whether its Ultimate Truth or the biggest lie ever conceived, either way, talking about it does nothing. Well, it does start fights pretty good.
Last time I checked I was doing quite fine thankyou.
I don’t think the problem is language, it’s competing conceptions.
The term omnipotent doesn’t necessarily include the idea of eternal – in fact, there’s a particular theological debate (beyond WHAT properties something called “god” might/must possess) about whether or not god exists beyond the space/time of THIS universe. For example, if the “multiverse” implied by string theory turned out to be fact, would god be the god of all universes, or just this one…and if so, how can one call it “eternal” in the absence of a concept of “time”?
Beyond that, if you’re going to say something like “God was always there and will always be there,” the why not simply say “The universe was always there,” or, “Life was always there,” and be done with it. Occam’s Razor demands that that you not multiply terms unnecessarily.
Zen koans like, “Can an omnipotent god make a rock so heavy even he cannot lift it” do not advance the argument.
The only sane response to those who claim there is a god is, “Fine. Show me the evidence.”
Nice link. Misleading title, though. The only people who insist that the universe came from nothing are creationists.
The odd thing is that they don’t seem to understand the irony of their argument. While insisting that science says “Everything came from nothing” (which is not at all what science says), THEY contend that the universe was poofed into existence by an act of omnipotent will.
Of course, inherent contradiction never stopped them before…
Thank you all for the posts. Very good points C. Avi.
I would like to read some kind of solid evidence (links, book titles – not the Bible – ETC) from Christians refuting what Cousin Avi has posted.
The concept of a “supreme being” as mentioned earlier, has been around for a very long time indeed. This does not make it true nor does it prove that one exists. People have also believed for a very long time that chicken feet and four-leaved clovers bring one good luck. Currently, in some parts of the world, it does one well to eat the body parts of an albino. Does that make it true? This concept developed out of an inability to explain a vast many things, including, for example, the way the ocean is drawn back a very significant amount before the arrival of a tidal wave. Well, I guess it must have been the power of god chanelled through Moses, ’cause I can’t think of anything else. Man continues to fail to “pluck the apple”, if you will, and simply evolve into a more intelligent species which refuses to ignore fact and act accordingly to it. The future is unknown and the unknown is terrifying to many and fear is powerful, and evolution is the future. We must be very brave to move forward. Don’t let others scare you with their bullshit. There is no heaven. There is no hell. You will not be rewarded or punished for any kind of life you’ve led. Don’t be afraid to change your mind. Don’t be afraid to admit that something you believe might be wrong. Don’t be afraid of the truth because it will never be what you want it to be no matter how hard you pray or want.
I think you’re out of luck, BP. Christians point to scripture. The rest of it leaves them in the blocks.