Godmen: Jesus (the new guy on the block), Horus, Osiris, Attis, Krishna, Mithra, Dionysus. Need a Savior? Take your pick!

Need a Savior? Take your pick!

This is an Oldie but Goodie from 2011…. Happy Reading!

With the recent Storm of Religious Dialogue on my Facebook Wall (and a few other FB walls) and the Almost Rapture where, at last, we could have finally been free of some of these Fanatics in our Hair (and we also could have had quite a show watching them soar naked through our atmosphere into Heaven), I decided to break it down.

Was Jesus a real man? Who cares?

What is interesting though is that the Idea of a Saviour (like Jesus) is an old – very old – Concept.

Below I have taken a few other Godmen, provided a link of said Godmen and the parallels they have – and characteristics they share –  with Jesus.

There are many links, but I’m trying to keep it simple… if this tickles a Synapse or two, dig a little deeper and see what you come up with.

I often hear  Christians spout something like this:

“Only Jesus has the right to forgive our sins because of the price He paid & the fact that He is the ONLY risen Lord, who has conquered death”

How then do we account for these Godmen – a few who also died and were resurrected? Each of these GodMen has been a Saviour; was part of a Trinity; a couple were Hung from a ‘tree’ and died; and was Resurrected. They all had followers, most had Disciples, most had a Virgin Birth. I have 7 listed, but there are more. Lots more.

1. Horus (c. 3000 BCE): http://foreverinhell.blogspot.com/2009/03/horus-worshippers.html

2. Osiris (c. 3000 BCE): http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_jcpa2.htm

3. Attis of Phrygia (c.1400 BCE) http://www.usislam.org/christianity/attis.htm

4. Krishna c. (1400 BCE  – possibly as early as 5771 BCE): http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_jckr1.htm

5. Mithra of Persia c. 600 BCE:  http://www.near-death.com/experiences/origen048.html

6. Dionysus c. 186 BCE: http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_jcpa2.htm

…and last but not least (and that’s debatable)

7. Jesus c. (4 to 7 BCE) – we don’t need to list anything here, it is all listed above with the other Godmen.

This next link gives an account of other solar gods (Jesus included) The similarities are worth pondering. Showing that there is nothing about Jesus that is ‘special’ per-se.

http://paganizingfaithofyeshua.netfirms.com/parallels_chart.htmAlso

check out this link for other Godmen who share some of the same Jesus characteristics:

http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_jcpa.htm

A bit on Matthew being full of BS and the mistranslation of “Virgin” and “Young Woman”:  http://www.vexen.co.uk/religion/matthew.html#virgin

Check these links out and if you would like to refute, disagree, write a rebuttal, please back them up with sources.

Have just been looking at these sources links:

Wow, this link answers a lot of questions:  http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/richard_carrier/homerandmark.html

http://www.dbskeptic.com/2009/09/13/pagan-parallels-to-jesus-the-forgotten-sons-of-god/

This is a very good read: http://www.vexen.co.uk/religion/christianity_nojesus.html

Exciting Bits about Matthew:  http://www.vexen.co.uk/religion/matthew.html#virgin

I think one can still follow the teachings of Jesus without the Dogma & BS the masses have been brainwashed/indoctrinated to believe.

Peace and Much Love

I will have more links and sources up soon.

The Reaction this post made on Facebook is noteworthy… They are informative, and at the very least amusing. We have both sides of the spectrum here, two extremes battling and the funny thing is, two of them have each other blocked on FB.

I have re-posted the comments here:

Virgin Birth! Disciples! Died and Resurrected! It’s… Horus! Uhm… Krishna! …no wait… Dionysus!   Sigh.
    • Christian Lecours I pray exclusively to Viking gods now. Have you seen Thor? It’s much, much better than Passion of Christ. I guess Dionysus (Bacchus?) would
      be a blast to hang out with though. (especially at theRefuge!)Hard to decide.

    • Michele Dicks Mr.Lecours: with all due respect, good luck with that Thor worship. Did you notice in the Bible that The God of Abraham kicked the pants off of all otherforiegn Gods?

    • Jeff Evansthe best god is the one that kicks the most ass !

    • Cousin Avi‎@ Michele Dicks: Thor has a hammer. Jesus was nailed to a cross. Any questions?

    • Michele Dicks

      No Mr. Avi. No questions because the answer is clear, though not to you, apparently. Greater love has no one than this, than to lay down one’s life for his friends. Jesus Christ, willingly, laid down his life for the multitude. Thor would n…ever do that for any of his servants, he would expect them to do so for him. Jesus Christ has conquered death, by His resurrection. Thor glorifies war & death. Who then is more powerful? The wielder of death or the conqueror of death?
    • Cousin Avi

      Well, it’s an interesting question. Very much like, “Who would win a race between Superman and The Flash?” Since none of them exist in the first place, it’s rather an exercise in fantastic speculation.
      I find it interesting that you have s…uch a poor opinion of Thor. Have you spent much time studying Norse mythology? Apparently you consider yourself well versed in Abrahamic mythology. Of course, you recognize that the bible is not to be considered an authority on such things. It was written long after the alleged events by people who weren’t there, and subsequently edited, redacted, re-edited, re-redacted, rewritten, re-re-edited, translated, mistranslated, and then translated again by various councils, committees and an occasional Pope.
      Or are you one of those people who insist, “If English was good enough for Jesus, it’s good enough for me!”
      If the bible is the inerrant word of god, why did it need to be edited?
      Michele DicksKnow what, Mr. Avi? I’ve been on these roller coasters on Paul’s threads before & it’s just getting so old. It’s the same thing over & over. The thing I find that makes me not want to continue is that sooner or later, things just get ugly. believe what you want & I will do the same. Have a good one.
    • Cha L.Michele: Is this the same god that has allowed/caused/scheduled recent, past, and upcoming disasters that have, and will cause, the deaths of millions who he or she has created in his or her own image? It must be the god of Abraham who is all-loving, kind, and perfect…except for his or her need for beings to love and serve him or her.Why does this god show up in about a hundred other religions and religious texts?

    • Cousin Avi

      I’m happy to do just that, Ms. Dicks. It’s a lamentable fact that more Christians aren’t like you – keeping matters of faith where it belongs, as a matter of personal belief. Sadly, far too many of the faithful seem determined to inflict …their theological delusions on school curriculum, women’s right to choose, tests for public office, etc.
      When Christians understand why they reject all other gods, perhaps they will then understand why I reject theirs. Until that halcyon day, I consider it necessary to continue pointing out that they have no evidence and no special knowledge. Cheers.
    • Michele Dicks

      To Cha L.: You obviously still have the need to search, I’m cool where I am. Good luck with your quest for the answers to the questions you posted. I just haven’t got the time to sit & get into this stuff anymore. I’m sure you can find anot…her person who believes in Jesus & The God of Abraham to answer their stance on these questions, hopefully, from a sensible perspective for you. I just haven’t got it in me anymore. These debates go around in circles, & I have a life to run & yet, here I am again…..geez…..bye now & good luckSee More
      Yesterday at 2:07am · LikeUnlike
    • Michele Dicksit’s not resignation, Mr. Avi, it’s just time to stop beating a dead horse & wasting my time on hopeless causes….I’m sure you’ll respond to this, seeming you have the need to have the last word….& to whatever you have to say, again I say,…. whatever….

    • Cousin Avi

      Aww…don’t be like that Ms. Dicks. You came in here blithering about how your imaginary deity could kick the ass of all the other imaginary deities. When it was pointed out that your beloved sky wizard was responsible for some pretty heinous shit – genocide, slavery, murder, incest and infanticide to name a few – you returned to that tired old John 3:16 bit.
      Of course, the POINT of this thread is that there have been MANY alleged gods who died and were resurrected, so your fantasy that Jesus was only one who conquered death is simply not true. Of course, that only makes it just like all the other claims about Jesus, and Thor, and Zeus, and Krishna.
      No doubt you do get tired of running in circles: “Jesus is the one true god!” How do you know? “Because it says so in the bible!” Why should we trust that? “Because Jesus said so!” Wash, rinse, repeat ad nauseum.
      You even stoop to the rather pathetic level of insulting my expected response, as if your condescending dismissive tone weren’t offensive on its face, especially when laced with the arrogant certainty evinced by so many of you loving Christians.
      You say “Whatever”, but like most of the things uttered by the followers of the lamb of god, you simply are not willing practice what you preach.
      In case you missed it, Cha was not asking for answers. That was rhetoric, wrapped in sarcasm, and designed to point out the stone hypocrisy of your stupid Jesus crap.
      You had suggested leaving well enough alone, but you Jesus gobblers are just not capable of that. If you want to stop beating a dead horse and wasting time on hopeless causes, put the Jesus down and find something useful to do.
      Cousin Avi‎”Whatever” in 3…2..1…

    • Michele Dicks

      blah blah blah blah,……I know that Cha wasn’t looking for answers….I know the nature of the post…. just because I am Christian does not mean that I am not capable of facetiousness. So because you are not Christian means that you can …be a rude dick & I am not allowed to retaliate because I am a Christian & would thus be called a hypocrite? You are free to abuse my character, freely, & I can not retaliate by calling a spade a spade w/out someone saying, “OH FOUL! You can’t say that, your Christian! “….. you apparently think I am simple minded. That’s too bad. Your responses are so laced with anger, why is that? I find it sad…
    • Cousin Avi

      Save the passive aggressive whining, Ms. Dicks. I never said Christians couldn’t behave like petulant, er…Dicks – I’ve come to expect it and you only confirm those expectations.
      If you were aware that Cha was being sarcastic, your faux si…ncere reply, then, is simply another example of your hypocrisy.
      If you’re not willing to stand up for your faith in a fairy tale; if you’re simply going to dismiss the objections you already know are going to come from your ridiculous claims about what a badass your Jesus is, then DON’T waste people’s time barging in to a thread about OTHER gods, yammering about how your god and ONLY your god gave his life for the multitudes.
      I most assuredly consider you simple minded. I find belief in Jesus on the one hand and the flippant dismissal of all other faith claims on the other to be a sure sign that one is dealing with, at best, a willfully blind buffoon if not an intellectually stunted blilthering imbecile.
      Of course, you would presume my dismissive attitude toward your religious beliefs must be based in anger. That’s your way of refusing to deal with the uncomfortable questions I present; how you tamp down the nagging doubt that rises when your blind faith encounters reason. “Oh, he just hates god!”
      That would be silly – hating something that doesn’t exist. What I dislike are people who join a conversation, spout arrogant certainties about things they simply CANNOT know anything about, and then when they are confronted with objections, whine up a storm, pretend they’re being attacked for their pure faith, take their ball and go home. Except YOU don’t go home. You keep whining.
      Fair enough. Whine away…but you can save expressing your phony impatience and world-weary exasperation. You called it on – suck it up and deal with it. Put on your Big Girl Jesus sandals…or simply stay out of conversations you can’t handle. But if you’re going to wade into the pool, don’t cry when you get splashed.”blah blah blah whatever” in 3…2…1…
    • Michele DicksYou are such an ass….

    • Cousin AviHow very Christian of you. Is that turning the other cheek, loving your enemy, or doing unto others? I get so confused. Of course, if you Jesus freaks ever lived up to the bullshit you quote from your book of fairy tales, the hypocrisy would be far more shocking.

    • Cousin Avi

      Oh for fuck sakes, you petulant little hypocrite…go pray, or stone something, or confess. Do some fucking thing. Your butthurt Jesus tears, delicious though they are, grow tiresome. Me and my Thor hammer are gonna go crucify another Na…zarene.
      “Why hast thou forsaken me, father?” Shut up, and stop squirming…it’ll hurt less if you just hold still.Indignant Christian outrage / passive aggressive “I pity you” bullshit in 3…2…1…
    • Michele Dickshole

      Christine PetersonCousin Avi, Your tolerance is abhorrent. Insults in a debate keep us from considering your opinion.

    • Cousin Avi

      ‎”Us?”…oh, (to coin a phrase) for heaven’s sake. Did Ms. Turn the Other Cheek recruit some help? How typical. Christian faith requires the reinforcement of the similarly deluded.
      And which arguments are you ignoring on the basis that I’…m not showing sufficient respect for your silly theology? Not to put too fine a point on it, but my “argument” is that you’re all engaged in a comforting delusion for which there is absolutely ZERO evidence; that the bible is a cobbled together work of fiction, and that anyone who actually believes it is suffering from a popular form of mental illness.
      As for tolerance, insofar as you keep your mythology to yourself, I have infinite amounts of it. The more you inflict your Jesus juice in threads about other gods – calling THEM weak, ridiculous, or false while asserting the strength, seriousness and reality of your own – I shall object. When you go further and attempt to inflict your stupid creation story in the science classroom, draft laws preventing women from controlling their own bodies, and promote intolerance of other faiths even as you demand it for your own, then a lack of tolerance on my part is the least you may expect – you’re in for a fight to the death.
      Your hypocrisy is abhorrent. Your facile and superficial religiosity is insulting. Your arrogance and condescension is nauseating. And reducing your cohort to childish name calling is such sweet reward. My schadenfreude overflows!
    • Christine PetersonI am not religious. Ihave been struggling with thisfor awhile.Its hard to feel intelligent and believe in God. But,its also something that has been taught and instilled in us since childhood. I truly want to hear both sides of the spectrum on this matter but, its hard for me to base validity on your opinion when your insulting and abhorrent..

    • Michele DicksOH! There you are, Mr. Avi! After your last rant, I thought you had a stroke

    • Cousin Avi

      Well, since you’re not being specific, which of my posts do you find insulting? What is it about my naked contempt for religious faith insults you? Am I supposed to treat belief in fairy tales seriously? Is that it? I haven’t called anyone names. I only commented when Ms. Dicks decided to mock my friend Mr. Lecours for stating his preference for Thor. SHE belittled his chosen theology while promoting Jesus as the one true god. If she is permitted to insult my friend, I take it as my absolute and unfettered right to expose the paucity and hypocrisy of HER alleged faith.
      One is entitled to the respect one gives, which is exactly what she got. Alternatively, one is entitled to the respect one EARNS, and in the case of the god of Abraham, I would be hard pressed to lower myself or employ sufficiently coarse language to defile and insult that rotten fucker in the manner he deserves.
      Michele Dicksblah……….blah…………*yawn*…….blah

    • Christine Peterson‎”petulant littlehypocrit”, “jesus sandals”, using someones last name in a reference to an insult. Please consider expressing yourself without aggression. I think you both have valid points but, yourself righteous attitude is not swaying me towards your point of view.

    • Cousin AviWell, Ms. Dicks, if it bores you, and not to another too fine a point on it, fuck off somewhere. No one dragged you in here, no one is forcing you to stay. Or is this some sort of semi-literate, rather dull attempt at martyrdom? Are you being steadfastly dismissive and banal for Jesus?

    • Michele DicksI was hoping that if I made you mad enough, you would pop a vein &keal

    • Michele Dicksas in die….idiot

    • Cousin Avi

      I’m not trying to persuade anyone of anything, Ms. Peterson.
      As I am growing tired of pointing out, Ms. Dicks opened by mocking my friend and asserting the truth of HER faith. She offered to quit – called it “beating a dead horse”. I AGR…EED. But she keeps coming back. And if you read the thread, it is plain that Ms. Dicks herself both began and elevated the level of condescension. “Whatever” is not a recognized form of respectful debate.
      And, as is plainly obvious, she is no kind of Christian (at least as she would have anyone define the term)…now either seriously or jokingly wishing death and again calling names. Both juvenile and pathetic. Of course, this is exactly the sort of behaviour I expect from those who claim to walk with Christ.
      While you may not find me persuasive, one would hope that such discreditable behaviour would make you think twice about accepting the vainglorious and contemptible theology that permits anyone to behave like a Dick.
    • Cousin AviCalling someone a petulant little hypocrite is not name calling if they are petulant, petty and hypocritical. Resipsa loquitur.

    • Christine PetersonWell, debates are a form of persuasion. I read debates and learn from them. But, when they become insulting no one is getting their point across. I wish to see you both debate on the issue without insults anddebauchary.Thats all.

    • Christine PetersonWe all need tolerance in co-existence. But, I love how BP’s status can create such an overwhelming surge of anger, love, pain, tears, happiness. It’s kind of cool to seeall of the emotion involved here.

      Cousin Avi

      The problem is, Ms. Peterson, that my initial position – that there is no god; that dismissing all other faiths in favour of belief in Jesus is the mark of the logically and intellectually bereft; that there is absolutely no evidence to sup…port such belief; that the bible is a book of fairy tales invented by Bronze Age shepherds; that the Christian faith is a harmful, damaging, patently evil social structure; that indoctrinating children into it is a form of child abuse – is insulting to believers on its face.
      This was never a debate. I am not seeking to resolve any question. I merely took offense at Ms. Dicks mockery of my friend’s preference for Thor and responded in kind. It has progressed from there only at her insistence.
      I say again, I am not angry and have never been angry at any point. No pain, no tears…nothing more than slight bemusement at the stamina of another believer. It always surprises me that people with so little ammunition are so determined to fight battles they simply cannot win.
    • Michele Dicks

      Ya know? Your right, Mr. Avi, I have let my feelings of disgust against you totally make me see red….And I apologize. Why? Because you are right. Ya see, the thing is, Christians aren’t allowed to let themselves be pushed over the edge. W…e are held to a higher standard than others & when we do mess up, like I so royally have, others get all excited & start with the stuff you are saying. Christ was perfect, Mr. Avi, not me. And it is much easier to let your emotions take control when sitting behind a key board, miles away from the person irritating you. I’m not perfect, by any means. No one is & Christians are not capable of being better than others, but they have a hope & belief in a God who understands this. Just because I am an utter failure does not change who Jesus was & still is. I’m sorry that my behavior has reflected on my Lord Jesus. For that I am sorry. But you have not been very nice….
    • Michele DicksAnd you didn’t just defend your friend against my callous comment. You insulted Jesus with your “nail” remark, so you were just as bad as me, no?

    • Cousin Avi

      ‎”We are held to higher standard.” A higher standard than whom? What arrogance. The ease and condescension with which you dismiss Buddhists, Jains, Hindus, Jews, Muslims…the vast majority of the human race. It is JUST this sort of arr…ogant certainty; this placing yourself on a pedestal based on YOUR particular fairy tale while dismissing all others (and in total ignorance of those faiths), that is so very galling.
      And then, after asserting that you are held to a higher standard, the eternal excuse; the perennial qualification that while your god is great, you are just a humble believer, imperfect and prone to the very sorts of conduct you abhor and castigate in others, and all without the self-awareness to be ashamed at such two-faced, hypocritical contrivance.
      Don’t apologize to me. I don’t believe it’s sincere but rather simply another form of posturing; dressing yourself up in a facade of the forgiveness and tolerance Christians love to talk about and which none of them ever really manage to achieve. Nothing more than praying loudly in public – the appearance without the substance.
      As for being NICE, the next time someone expresses faith in Thor, or Allah, or Jehovah, or Krishna, PERHAPS you won’t leap in to tell them how wrong they are and assert that YOUR god is the one true god, who because YOUR book says so, kicked the pants off all the “foreign gods” (Foreign to where, one might ask? To whom?) Perhaps when YOU treat other people’s faith with the respect you demand, you’ll find more of it coming your way. Until then, you have no right to ask anyone to be nice.
      As for “insulting Jesus” that’s YOUR perspective. Perfectly reasonable people would see it as statements of facts: Thor had a hammer. Jesus was nailed to cross. Which of those statements is not true? Which is an insult?
    • Michele Dicks

      I don’t hold myself to a higher standard, other people do. When they know you are a Christian, as soon as you are heard to swear or slam the steering wheel & yell when someone cuts you off, they yell, ” You hypocrite! How unchristian of you…!” people don’t do that sort of thing to Buddhists & Muslims. I wasn’t saying that I put MYSELF to a higher standard, I have it done to me all the time. My apology is sincere. I’m sorry that I got so mad & took all of this so personally. Your Paul’s friend & I apologize to him as well. Your right, I was disrespectful to your friend’s admission that he prays to thor. I’m not saying this as an excuse, but I am definitely effected by the mockery of Christianity that I face on a daily basis online. As far as your statements concerning thor & Jesus, let’s be honest, your comment was designed to try to put me in my place because you were annoyed with what I said to your friend. I should of ignored it, but I took the bait. I don’t want to fight with you anymore & I’m sorry that I called you names. Can’t we just get to a point where we are not fighting anymore & try to tolerate each other? We are both Paul’s friends and I’m sure we will run into each other again. Haven’t you ever seriously had it out with someone & then called a truce? My anger has totally dissipated & I really am sorry, for the whole messy affair..
    • Cousin Avi

      I was never angry. You may expect to be mocked. Your faith posits that anyone who does not agree with you will be cast into a lake of fire for eternity. In the TOTAL absence of anything remotely resembling evidence, you assert the truth …of your mythology while dismissing everyone else’s. Some of you assert that the earth is 6000 years old. Others that the Rapture is upon us…and if not last weekend, then SOON! Various Christian sects engage in child abuse, child rape, polygamy, racism, misogyny, and demand to be permitted to inflict their dogmatic beliefs on secular government. If these things are not worthy and deserving of at least mockery, nothing is.
      Yes, my initial comment was absolutely designed to put you in your place. Clearly it failed in that regard.
      If you don’t wish to be held to higher standard than others, stop claiming special knowledge. You know nothing more about god or gods than anyone else no matter how fervently you believe that you do.
      As I have previously said, repeatedly, to the degree that anyone of any faith keeps their beliefs to themselves, I have an infinite degree of tolerance. I neither care what you believe, or that you believe it. To the degree you assert in public that you are right and others are wrong, my tolerance ebbs. And the moment anyone of any faith attempts to jam that faith into secular government, I consider that an act of war.
      I was prepared long ago to call it a day, and am now still so inclined. This tete a tete only continued at your call. And now, I bid you good morning. Please grant one courtesy: resist any impulse you might feel to pray for me.
    • Christine PetersonWell, I have learned something. I grew up with religion but it was not paramount in our house.  A lot of this I never knew. I never heard of Thor before this discussion either. So, thanks everyone for the info.

      Cha L.Christine, I grew up in a Christian household. It’s a pity that there was less information. To say that knowing of other mythological deities would have enhanced my life and intelligence would be beside the point, but the fact that other gods were evil, wrong, or fake WAS the daily point. This, I find/found disturbing.

    • Cha L.

      Michele, to derive that I need to search more is saying that you have found the ultimate truths and that I will arrive at the same place sooner or later. This, I have not taken offense at because it is the same answer I used to give when co…unseling potential Christians. It is, however, slightly laughable and technically insulting because whoever takes the time to reply to threads and debates like these should have already thought, pondered, questioned, and formed many opinions on said matter. Otherwise, it’s spewing hogwash.I am dearly close to many religious people. It’s a pity when I can’t discourse in depth with them on the subject of their faiths as they are almost literally blinded by their beliefs and yet show much insight into a great many other things. A pity.
    • Michele Dicks

      ‎@ Cha L.: Hi. You seem like a nice person & I’m sorry to get so on the defense like I do…..but considering your background, could you (seriously) please try to answer a question for me that I have been struggling with? Why do people so r…eadily embrace other gods, like thor & so wholeheartedly reject Jesus & the God who sent him? Why??? He has so much to offer us, & what do these other gods offer that makes them so appealing?
    • Cousin AviSince that was not directed at me, I shall not answer. I will, however, point out that the question is inherently biased and constructed on at least three false premises. Asking poor questions never results in good answers.

    • Michele Dicks‎@Avi: go crawl back under your rock, will ya?

    • Cha L.

      Michele: Today, people have embraced Thor as being god, or real, about as much as they have embraced Spiderman to have truly existed. The worship of Buddha, in my opinion, stems from his religion appealing to the intellect. I’d say he had m…uch to offer. Other prophets and gods have as much to offer to their followers as does the Christian gods. Every religion’s followers believe that their religion is right and that their prophets and gods ARE the true ones… etc. All things connected and stemming from religiousness isn’t all bad. Ex: temples of worship offer sanctuary, people feel better about themselves because of some deeds they have done in the name of religion.On the flip side, have you tried to consider the unimaginable damage religious fervor has done to mankind? From bringing up children to hate non-believers or to believe that they themselves, or friends, will burn in hell to horrific genocide, I stand on the side of atheism.
    • Cha L.Humanism, knowledge, experiential knowledge, awareness, the scientific method, logic (2+2=4) and open-mindedness is what I hope to stand for. HUMANISM!

    • Cha L.

      As for continuing this discussion, it’s obvious where you stand, Michele. I hope it is with me. I have books of memorized Bible verses which I could place here as a parting word, but in the wise words of Krishnamurti, “In this there is no t…eacher; no pupil…there is no leader. There is no guru. There is no master, no savior…You yourself are the teacher and the pupil; you are the master, you are the guru, you are the leader. You are everything! And… to understand is to transform what is.”
    • Michele Dicks

      Cha L.: I was raised Catholic, does that explain a lot? I don’t consider myself Catholic anymore, as a matter of fact, I have rejected many principles taught by the Catholic church. I consider myself a Christian but my sister says I still s…ound very “catholicy”..lol I don’t want to have a high & mighty attitude, but what’s the sense of believing in something at all if you can’t proclaim that it is the truth & if there are so many “faith truths” that lead to the same end, why bother with so many? It is disheartening to think that so many people who want to get to the same place can’t meet in the middle w/out wanting their beliefs to be the “right” one & I am guilty of that, I’ve learned. It feels like the foundation of my world is being shaken. The thought of there not being any truth to what I believe is enough to make me wonder what’s the sense of this life for then?
    • Kristen LeNormand AruteEveryone needs to do what I did and block Cuz Avi. It is so much more peaceful on FB without him. He is a playground bully with the bitterness of a scorned woman and the mouth of the foulest trucker. (I apologize for offending bullies, women and truckers.)

    • Kristen LeNormand AruteBear in mind that Paul says, “sic ’em” to Avi, and Avi doesn’t ask “how far” – he knows exactly what Paul means. Women should wash their hands of the two of them and their misogynistic ways.

    • Kristen LeNormand Arute

      With that being said, I am eager to dissect the list. Let me start by saying that Jesus predicted in Matthew 24:24 and Mark 13:22 that there would be false gods. So it’s no surprise that there are lots of other dying and rising god claims… in other religions. The vast majority of critical scholars have abandoned the idea that the story of the resurrection of Jesus was borrowed from pagan mythology. Check out resurrection specialist Gary Habermas’ website. He says that he can count on one hand the number of scholars who have written the 2000+ books on the subject who attribute the resurrection to mythology. http://www.garyhabermas.com/
    • Kristen LeNormand Arute

      ‎”First, the claims of Jesus as a myth or an exaggeration originated in the writings of 19th century liberal German theologians. Their claim was essentially that Jesus was nothing more than a copy of the widespread worship of dying and risi…ng fertility gods in various places—Tammuz in Mesopotamia, Adonis in Syria, Attis in Asia Minor, and Osiris in Egypt. None of these works ever advanced in the realm of academia and religious thought because their assertions were investigated by theologians and scholars and determined to be completely false and baseless. It has only been in the late twentieth and early twenty-first century that these assertions have been resurrected, primarily due to the rise of the internet and mass distribution of information that has no historical foundation or accountability.”
    • Kristen LeNormand Arute

      • Horus was born to Isis; there is no mention in history of her being called “Mary.” Moreover, Mary is our anglicized form of her real name ‘Miryam’ or Miriam. “Mary” was not even used in the original texts of Scripture.
      • Isis was not a vir…gin; she was the widow of Osiris and conceived Horus with Osiris.
      • Horus was born during month of Khoiak (Oct/Nov), not December 25. Further, there is no mention in the Bible as to Christ’s actual birth date.
      • There is no record of three kings visiting Horus at his birth. The Bible never states the actual number of magi that came to see Christ.
      • Horus is not a “savior” in any shape or form; he did not die for anyone.
      • There are no accounts of Horus being a teacher at the age of 12.
      • Horus was not “baptized.” The only account of Horus that involves water is one story where Horus is torn to pieces, with Isis requesting the crocodile god to fish him out of the water he was placed into.
      • Horus did not have a “ministry.”
      • Horus did not have 12 disciples. According to the Horus accounts, Horus had four semi-gods that were followers and some indications of 16 human followers and an unknown number of blacksmiths that went into battle with him.
      • There is no account of Horus being betrayed by a friend.
      • Horus did not die by crucifixion. There are various accounts of Horus’ death, but none of them involve crucifixion.
      • There is no account of Horus being buried for three days.
      • Horus was not resurrected. There is no account of Horus coming out of the grave with the body he went in with. Some accounts have Horus/Osiris being brought back to life by Isis and going to be the lord of the underworld.
    • Kristen LeNormand Arute

      But what does history say about Mithras?• He was born out of a solid rock and not from any woman.
      • He battled first with the sun and then a primeval bull, thought to be the first act of creation. Mithras killed the bull, which then became the ground of life for the human race.
      • Mithras birth was celebrated on December 25, along with Winter solstice.
      • There is no mention of him as being a great teacher.
      • There is no mention of Mithras having 12 disciples. The idea that Mithras had 12 disciples may have come from a mural in which Mithras is surrounded by twelve signs of the Zodiac.
      • Mithras had no bodily resurrection. The myth is told that Mithras completed his earthly mission then was taken to paradise in a chariot, alive and well. The early Christian writer Tertullian did write about Mithras believers re-enacting resurrection scenes, but he wrote about this occurring well after New Testament times, so if any copycatting was done, it was the cult of Mithras copying from Christianity.
    • Kristen LeNormand Arute

      More examples can be given of Krishna, Attis, Dionysus and other mythological gods, but the result is the same. In the end, the historical Jesus as portrayed in the Bible is thoroughly unique. The claimed similarities are greatly exaggerate…d. Further, while belief in Horus, Mithras, and others pre-dated Christianity, there is very little historical record of the pre-Christian beliefs of those religions. The vast majority of the earliest writings about these religions is dated to the third and fourth centuries A.D. It is illogical and unhistorical to claim the pre-Christian beliefs in these religions (of which there is no record) were identical to the post-Christian beliefs in these groups (of which there is record). It is more historically valid to attribute any similarities between these religions and Christianity to the religions copying Christian beliefs about Jesus and placing those attributes on their own gods/saviors/founders in an attempt to stop the rapid growth of Christianity.
    • Kristen LeNormand Arute

      ‎”While much has been written on this topic, no work from antiquity has more evidence with respect to historical veracity than the New Testament. The New Testament has more writers (nine), better writers, and earlier writers than any other …document from that era. Further, history testifies to the fact that these writers went to their deaths for claiming that Jesus had risen from the dead. While some may die for a lie they think is true, no person dies for a lie they know to be false. Think about it—if someone was about to crucify you upside down, as happened to the Apostle Peter, and all you had to do to save your life was renounce a lie you had knowingly been living, what would you do?”
    • Kristen LeNormand Arute

      ‎”In addition, history has shown that it takes at least two generations to pass before myth can enter into a historical account. Why? Because eyewitnesses can refute error put in print. Those living at the time could refute the errors of th…e author and expose the work as being false. All the Gospels of the New Testament were written during the lifetime of the eyewitnesses, with some of Paul’s epistles being written as early as 50 A.D. That early dating acts as a key protective mechanism against any falsehoods being accepted and circulated.”
    • Kristen LeNormand Arute

      ‎”In conclusion, the claims that Jesus is nothing more than a myth, a copy of mythological gods, originated from authors whose works have been discounted by academia, commit logical fallacies that undermine their veracity, and cannot compar…e to the New Testament Gospels which have withstood nearly 2,000 years of intense scrutiny. The alleged parallels disappear when they are compared with the original historical texts. Similarities between Jesus and the various mythological gods can only be argued for by employing selective and misleading descriptions.”
    • Kristen LeNormand Arute‎”Jesus Christ stands unique in history, with His voice rising above all false gods and continuing toask the question that ultimately determines a person’s eternal destiny: “Who do you say that I am?” (Matthew 16:15)”

    • Michele Dicks

      ‎@ Paul: here is an example of my prayer being answered…….I prayed for God…(God the Father, of Jesus) so there is no miss-understanding….I prayed for Him to please send me the information I needed to explain the claims you made about these historical godmen. I prayed for clarity & understanding. I prayed for peace & truth in this matter which disturbed me, because I had no knowledge of any of it…..And I know you won’t see it this way….but he sent Kristen as an answer to this prayer…I know he did. He knew just the right way to help me…& He did. She doesn’t know this ( now she does ) but she answered an urging from the Holy Spirit to step in & address this issue…..I am so grateful to her for being my friend. Only God could know how much this means & proves His reality to me. The response is so precise & blatant, I can not miss it….That is how most miracles are, Paul. Only very clear to the person they are meant for. God does this for a reason. He wants us to believe by faith & trust in Him, not by scholarly proof…Kristen answered this matter on your level, maybe so that one day, you will come to believe again? Maybe….:)
    • Michele Dicks

      Especially with that very last quote from scripture. “Who do YOU say that I am”….I know that that was for me….I felt it pierce my heart…Any doubt that was haunting me has been washed away….My Lord didn’t let me flounder for long. He… saved me…Yes, my faith was tested. And when I faltered, my Lord “put His hands under me”…& gave me what I needed . This faith I have, that is solid as a rock, came from Him, you see…not of myself. And He will not let it be taken from me…When it was threatened, He intervened & put a stop to the threat…..amazing…..Why would I not want to worship a God who saves me from falling? Who always watches over me & keeps me in the palm of His hand? Anything of this world can be taken from me, & it is no big deal….sometimes He lets this happen. But to allow me to be taken from Him? Things (people) who belong to Him, He will never allow to be taken from Him. If you give yourself up willingly, that is different. But He knows the heart of a person. When your heart cries out for help, he gives it….I know….& that can’t be taken from me
    • Boston PaulMichele, this is not prayer being answered, Good Woman. This is not a miracle. This was to be expected. This is like flushing and praying for it to go down…The ‘got questions’ is a Christian website… Ms. Arute is using the Bible to defend the Bible.No one needs to block Cousin Avi. Michele, you handled him just fine. Ms.Arute was not accustomed to being ripped apart and hersnootiness did not work with him… scroll down my wall and you will see what took place, if it is not there, I will reproduce it for you.I will review your comments, Ms. Arute, thank you for taking the time to post them.

      Cha, thank you too for your posts. They were refreshing.

      The comments here were so good, I am going to make them part of this post I put up on my blog.

      Kristen LeNormand Arute and Cousin Avi since you cannot read what the other has posted, you can go here:

      https://bostonpaul.wordpress.com/2011/05/23/godmen-jesus-the-new-guy-on-the-block-horus-osiris-attis-krishna-mithra-dionysus-need-a-savior-take-your-pick/

      Keep em’ coming and a friend of mine Sean Luo posted this today:

      ~A monk is met by a man, he does not know, who immediately starts hurling a continuous barrage of insults at him. The monk keeps his silence until the screaming man exhausts himself. Then the monk asks him: “If you offer me a gift and I do not take it, to whom does the gift belong?” The man responds: “It would still belong to me.” So the monk tells him: “I do not take your insults.”~

      Y’all take it from there.

      Peace and Lots of Secular Human Earthling LOVE!

Hate-Mail/Rebuttal – Concerning Flags, Hairy Ape Balls, Sun Zi: The Art of War

I get letters in my various Inboxes regarding various bits I publish. Often they are positive in nature, occasionally there are much appreciated Constructive Criticisms  and yes the rare occasion I get a bit of hate-mail…or perhaps very strong dislike mail. Below is one of those bits that found my way into my box. Often I copy and paste them into a file – like I do most everything – and save it for good reading on a rainy day. It wasn’t raining, but I decided to respond to this one.

I had written a bit on Osama Bin-laden (you can find it here:  https://bostonpaul.wordpress.com/2011/05/04/osama-bin-laden-the-world-rejoices-or-does-it/)  and of the numerous Inquiries in my box, most of them polite, I stumbled across this one. Paused. Smiled… and began to write.

Here it is:

Daniel London (May 6, 2011): You can suck hairy ape balls. The flag is a symbol of freedom that brings people together, REMEMBER 9-11

The Militant Hippi (May 7, 2011) I’d rather not suck any balls at all, thank you.

Greetings Mr. London,

The flag is a representation of the government. The government does not necessarily represent The People. It is difficult however for those who ‘love’ the flag to NOT love the Flag since most of us have been Indoctrinated since kindergarten to ‘love the Flag’… probably you included.

Have you ever said the Pledge of Allegiance? Why would one have to say this pledge? It is part of the Public (AKA government controlled) Education Indoctrination System… and you (and millions of others including – at one time – me) are victims of it… though now there are millions waking up.

I even have Flags tattooed on my chest as I was a soldier in the 82nd Airborne Division from 18 – 22 years of age… but I grew up and I got wise.

I realized that the Government (and the corporations that control it) are only concerned with having Nice Dumb Sheep for a populace. Why? Because Sheep are easy to control…

Brainwash them when they are young, so that they think everything they say is ‘right’… it is a great (and evil) Trick.

Do you know The Art of War by Sun Tzu (Sun Zi)?  The Art of War is a 2500 year old document. West Point Military Academy (and interestingly Harvard Business School) both have this as a text-book in their colleges.

The Art of War states that are two ways to keep The People under Control:

The First Way (and this works in a 3 part concert) is:

A. Keep the People Fed. Hungry People start Revolutions.

B. Keep the People Entertained. This distracts them from looking at the bigger problems.  How many Americans are glued to the TV and all the BS Media Drama? How many Americans get their news from Fox News? How many listen to the ass-clowns of ass-clowns Glenn Beck?  A distracted populace is a Government’s Ally.

C. Keep the People Ignorant of what The Government does. A Public Education System (AKA Indoctrination) that is government controlled of course will insure this.  Get em’ when they’re young and they are yours forever.

The Second Part of Keeping this Control, and this is the most effective – is to keep The People living in a constant state of FEAR.

(Look out a Terrorist might be over there! No wait, he’s over there!)

How many Terrorists have been caught (and convicted) since 911 on US soil? None. Check it out. They made all these laws not to control Terrorism, but to control the People. The Patriot Act is the biggest piece of BS Document since Hitler (he had a similar document: The Enabling Act. This allowed him to invade Poland… the parallels between Nazi Germany and Amerika are astounding).

I won’t forget 911… and I will spend the rest of my days Inquiring into why it happened… If you would like to engage in any kind of discourse considering 911, I would love to know what you know, and I am happy to share any information with you as well.

FLAGS: Flags only bring people together within a country (and it is usually coerced).

Flags divide. They do not bring The People of the world together. They create an us VS them mentality.  Are you a sports fanatic? Flags do similar things in sports as well. WE are the best. WE are God’s Chosen. We hear this BS all the time. Problem is, most everyone thinks this way; i.e. my country is better than yours, my team is better than yours… ad nauseam.

WE are selfish mammals that have not evolved into whatever comes after dumb mammals.

Remember, we are Earthlings first!

Thank you for the expressive note Mr. London. Your last name conjures up one of my favorite authors, Jack London.

Any relation?

Jack London was quite the Socialist and wrote many prolific pieces. If you have not read him, check him out. Looking forward to hearing back from you.

May 9, 2011. Still no response

July 20, 2011. No response. We can probably guess he won’t be responding back, eh?

Published in: on May 9, 2011 at 3:14 PM  Comments (1)  
Tags: , , , , ,

Osama Bin Laden: The World Rejoices! … or does it?

Osama Bin Laden is Dead! The World rejoices! Or does it?

I have been repeating my thoughts around various parts of the internet, so some of this may sound familiar to you, but here it goes:

Here are a few Things of Note I would like to mention that seem to keep getting lost in the whirlwind academy award-esque Drama that has been folding & unfolding and creased so bad that the best dry cleaner in in Washington’s China-Town couldn’t straighten it out.

First, it should be well known that Osama Bin Laden (OBL) was never charged with the 911 travesty by the FBI. Here is the link to the site:

http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/topten/usama-bin-laden

and

http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/topten

The FBI has recently updated this and put a red deceased sign across his mug.

Note that Osama was on the FBI most wanted list but NOT for 911. The FBI states that there is/was not enough evidence.

Bin Laden has admitted to everything he was part of in the past and I’m sure for a Terrorist, 911 would have been the Crowned King of Terror… what Terrorist would not want to boast that (s)he orchestrated an event like 911 then subsequently take the credit for this heinous deed?      OBL did not.

NOTE:  praising a Heinous Act and carrying out a Heinous Act are two different animals.

One should not get assassinated because one praised 911.  And why did OBL praise the perps of 911 (would be ironic if the US Government had something to do with 911, eh? OBL praising a US deed? Don’t laugh, the US let Pearl harbor happen, did they not?)

Also know that I’m not condoning anything OBL has done. I abhor his acts of Terrorism as emphatically as I do the American Government’s Acts of Terrorism in the Middle East. Violence is to be abhorred no matter who the arbitrary Good Guys and Bad Guys are.

Why does the Public feel the way they do about OBL? Let’s ask a question to answer a question: What Medium have the American Masses  – and the rest of the world – been using to get their information?

The Popular Media? Media controlled by Huge Corporations? Those very same corporations that control governments – including The Government that is occupying much of the world in one form or another?

They are praising the Death of a Villain because of what the Media has purported him to be? No Trial? No Justice? Hell… no Body, no autopsy, no independent observers, no record of his capture, it all sounds like something is Rotten in Denmark to me.

Remember too, OBL was an ally with the US government until early 1990s as they had a common enemy with the Soviet Union. The Bush Family is still friends with the Bin laden Family in Saudi Arabia. Last I heard, they still send each other Holiday Cards.

Conspiracy Theories: I am a skeptic and I do ask questions. The problem is that now if someone questions the government (especially after 911) they are dubbed ‘conspiracy nuts’ which then means that no-one gets a Voice.

It is an ingenious trick of the Media: Trust your government wholeheartedly, don’t ask questions – and if you do, you’re a nut. This is a very stealth way to suppress Freedom of Speech… and many Americans – and a couple of Canadians I know – have fallen into this Trap.

Sadly, most Americans – once Ferocious Warriors –  for Freedom & Peace, have been reduced Blithering Sheep who don’t ask questions, jump on the Nationalistic Bandwagon and attack anyone who thinks differently.

Everyone is caught up in the Media Blitz, The Band Wagon Hatred in the name of misconstrued Patriotism (AKA Nationalism).

Very few know one iota about OBL save what they hear on CNN, FOX and other Powerful Corporate Controlled Media.

People are talking much the same way they would a TV show (who shot JR?) It seems the Realness is taken out, but the Drama is not.

Movies, Dramas… a good book, a real or fictitious story – all evoke Emotion… sprinkle a bit of Fear & Ignorance ( ignorance oft resulting in fear ) and you have your Frenzy; your Nationalistic fervor… your Lynch Mob.

So questions I have – but may never know the answers to – are simply:

Is Osama Bin Laden merely a Glorified Scape-goat?

Is he a Myth devised by the CIA (he worked with them in the 8Os)?

OBSERVATIONS: What impact will this have on OBL’s Family (again -friends with the Bush family… what effect will this have on the Bush/Bin-Laden family Relationship)?

Is he the relative of the Bin-Ladens (and other Saudi Nationals) that were whisked out of the country hours after 911 when all planes were grounded? ( that’s power!)

What will the Movie they make be like? And how will this re-enforce the Myth, the Legend, the BS, The Untruths, The Misconceptions and the Nationalistic Fervor one country has and uses against another?

We have hit a cross roads. What does it take to achieve World Peace? The Killing of more Villains to pacify the Ignorant Masses?

Power to The People.

What is Power? Knowledge.

What is Knowledge? Information.

Where are we getting our information from then?

Will update soon.

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